Canada’s federal government has leased a fleet of 10 firefighting aircraft in advance of what is predicted to be a serious wildfire season. Firefighting is a provincial responsibility in Canada but the federal government is leasing the aircraft for distribution to provinces that may need extra help this year. An “extreme El Nino” forming in the eastern Pacific is expected to bring a hot, dry summer to much of Canada, adding to drought conditions in some areas. “These additional aircraft will strengthen Canada’s wildfire response, protect front-line personnel and protect communities across the country,” said Eleanor Olszewski, the federal minister of emergency management.
The pool of aircraft include four De Havilland Dash-8 tankers, which hold about 2,500 gallons of fire retardant, three Airbus AS332L and L1 helicopters with drop buckets that carry up to 1,000 gallons, and two Sikorsky S-92A helicopters that carry about 1,200 gallons. There is also a bird dog aircraft to guide the fixed-wing tankers. The aircraft are wet leased and come with their own crews and maintenance programs. They will be based in high priority areas as the fire risks become known.
Since these are leased aircraft, are they going to be unavailable elsewhere? They aren’t new tankers.
But what if they are “new” tankers?
That would imply serious forward-thinking from the federal government – seems less likely. These conversions don’t happen overnight.
They don’t, they take about 90 days give or take. There’s a number of types of tankers being produced at this time, 737s, Dash 8s, A319 in development.
These airplanes could be airframes new to the industry, you’re implying they’re robbing Peter to pay Paul and stealing these airplanes from another location…that’s not necessarily the case.
How many Dash 8 tankers existed a year ago and how many exist now? I think you might be surprised by that answer.
Go ahead and surprise me with data. It would be good news.
There’s six Q400s operating in the US now, and a dozen or so in Canada. All of those coming over the last few years. C-130s are being added to the fleet, I think two or three in the last two years. A319s are in development. Airplanes are being built, and they’ll all need to go to work somewhere.
I know Coulson acquired some C-130Hs from the RNZAF recently – not sure how far through conversion they are.
No-one is arguing that new conversions are not taking place.
You said “they aren’t new tankers”.
I’m simply demonstrating that they might be…very likely even. I’d put money on them being recent converted airplanes.
They MIGHT be – seems unlikely to me. 10 new tankers are suddenly available for lease?
No-one has been able to show that they aren’t simply being leased here instead of potentially being used elsewhere. You suggesting you’d bet just further proves you’ve no data either.
Your whole premise is dumb. If they weren’t leased to Canada, they would surely be used elsewhere.
You say there are no new tankers. I’ve provided plenty of examples of new tankers being built. Tankers 180-186, all Q400s added in the last three years. So many T540 or T550 series Q400s built for Canadian markets in that time frame that I can’t count. T136, T138, T140 all C130s recently added. Plus Coulson is adding 737s and developing a 767 tanker. Neptune is developing the A319.
You imply that these are being “stolen” from somewhere else that is in need, and I’m providing an alternate opinion that they’re airplanes that have recently been added to the fleet and weren’t committed elsewhere yet.
“If they weren’t leased to Canada, they would surely be used elsewhere.”
This is where I started.
“You say there are no new tankers.”
No, I haven’t said that.
“I’m providing an alternate opinion”
That you are. I just asked if you could prove it.
You said “They aren’t new tankers” in your first comment.
I’ve provided as much information as is publicly available to determine there are in fact new tankers.
You made the first claim. You provide the evidence that supports being “unavailable elsewhere”.
It’s physics. If an aircraft is in one place, it cannot be in another.
You have provided zero evidence that the tankers in question are new. Some might be, but you are speculating.
I’m speculating? What the heck are you doing?
They don’t have to be new, maybe the vendor had a contract expire.
I think it’s highly unlikely that the vendor pulled those airplanes from a current client and told them to pound sand.
Your first post made it seem like the number of tankers was finite, implying that the pool of aircraft was such that a new client means an old client goes without.
I’ve provided examples of how that pool has grown over the past few years, if you still think the airplanes are taken from another client and that client is without now…then just keep on believing that…
“Your first post made it seem like the number of tankers was finite”
Well it certainly isn’t infinite or even particularly elastic.
It’s seen pretty good growth in the last ten years, at least in the US. Lots of changes in Canada too.
What client is going without 4 Dash 8s so that Conair can lease them to Canada?
Sikorski? I didn’t realize Sikorsky made the S-92 in Poland.
Sigh. Thanks Tom. Fixed.